Heading to Mid-Ohio with IndyCar Legend Bobby Rahal

ROGER:

This is Roger Penske and you're listening to pit pass indie sponsored by Penske truck rental.

BRUCE:

IndyCar fans, it's time to skirt your engines. Welcome to Pit Pass Indy, a production of Evergreen Podcast. I'm your host, Bruce Bartman, journalist who regularly covers the NTT IndyCar Series. Our goal at Pit Pass Indy is to give racing fans an insider's view of the exciting world of the NTT IndyCar Series in a fast-paced podcast featuring interviews with the biggest names in the sport. I bring nearly 40 years of experience covering IndyCar and NASCAR, working for such media brands as NBCSports.com, SI.com, ESPN SportsTicker, Sports Illustrated, AutoWeek and SpeedSport. So let's drop the green flag on this episode of Pit Pass Indy. Welcome to this special bonus edition of Pit Pass Indy presented by Penske Truck Rental as we continue our fifth season of giving IndyCar fans an inside look at the most exciting form of racing on the planet, the NTT IndyCar Series. And a big thanks to Penske Truck Rental for helping bring you the inside stories of IndyCar from the paddock to the racetrack to the highways and streets of America. The NTT IndyCar Series had its last weekend off before hitting an extended portion of the schedule that will include five races in a four-week span, beginning with the July 6th Honda Indy 200 at Mid-Ohio. The annual 4th of July weekend trip to the Amish countryside of Ohio has become a highlight of the schedule as racing fans load up the campers and celebrate the great American holiday, IndyCar style. It's also the home of the Rahalls, Ohio's first family of racing, including three-time kart champion and 1986 Indianapolis 500 winner Bobby Rahall and his son, Graham, who grew up at Mid-Ohio and won the 2015 IndyCar Series race at the popular road course located between Columbus and Cleveland. Today we celebrate Bobby Rahal's 40th anniversary of his first Mid-Ohio IndyCar victory in 1985. He also won at Mid-Ohio in 1986. Rahal competed in 16 IndyCar races at Mid-Ohio and finished on the podium an impressive eight times. The 72-year-old Rahal will be honored before the July 6th Honda Indy 200 at Meadow, Ohio, serving as the grand marshal of the race. He will give the command, drivers, start your engines, before the race. Rahal had an incredible record as an IndyCar driver with three series championships, 24 wins, including the 1986 Indianapolis 500, and 17 poles. He was also an accomplished sports car racer with wins in the 1981 Rolex 24 at Daytona and the 1987 12 Hours of Sebring. Rahal retired as a driver following the 1998 season and has become a successful IndyCar team owner, including the 2004 Indianapolis 500 victory with Buddy Rice as the driver and the 2020 Indy 500 win with Takuma Sato as the winning driver. Off the track, Rahal is an extremely successful businessman. His business interests include Bobby Rahal Automotive Group, a network of car dealerships in Western and Central Pennsylvania selling Acura, BMW, Honda, Jaguar, Land Rover, Lexus, Mercedes-Benz, Toyota, and Volvo. As a tribute at WeatherTech Raceway at Laguna Seca, the back straight leading up the corkscrew was named the Rahal Straight in his honor. Let's hear from the famed driver and owner as Bobby Rahal joins me for this exclusive deep dive interview for Pit Pass Indy. A real hero is going to be honored later this week at the Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course. It's Ohio's own Bobby Rahal, who's going to be the grand marshal for this weekend's Honda Indy 200 at Mid-Ohio. Bobby, they're going to celebrate the 40th anniversary of one of your victories at Mid-Ohio. When you got the call that you were going to have this honor, how excited were you?

ROGER:

Oh, I'm very, very pleased. Obviously, you know, I had a lot of success at MidOhio in various cars, you know, and, you know, it really was kind of my home track, you know, for many years, you know, when I moved back to Ohio in 19, 81 to help start True Sports up and then of course, you know, Jim Truman had always been a sponsor of mine and really became a sponsor when we started True Sports. You know, so middle high was, as I say, I mean it was really kind of the home track and for not just me, but Jim, everybody and everybody at true sports there as a team. And so we, we did have a lot of success there. And so I'm, I'm thrilled. I know it's going to be a heck of a race this weekend. Uh, really looking forward to coming back. And of course, when they asked me if I, if I, if they could honor me, I, of course, I, uh, I was very, uh, yeah, very thankful at the initiatives. Um, you know, um, Uh, you know, uh, it's, uh, again, it's kind of like, uh, it's kind of like the, the, uh, uh, I don't know. I like another victory. I'm in Ohio for them to, uh, to, to ask and recognize me for this. So I'm looking, really looking forward to, and of course, great fans, uh, always were great fans. And, and, um, so yeah, it should be a heck of a weekend.

BRUCE:

Speaking of it feeling like another victory at mid Ohio, when you won there 40 years ago in 1985, you came back the next year and won it again in 1986. Yeah.

ROGER:

Yeah. And, and sort of one at eight and 87, if I hadn't made a mistake and tripped over a lap car, you know, a two verse three allowed two laps ago or whatever. But yeah, I, uh, uh, again, uh, a lot of success. For me in mid Ohio, I won my first, uh, I guess maybe it was my first, uh, FCC national race there in the fall of 74. Uh, you know, I, um, uh, um, yeah, one, of course, uh, the IMSA race, you know, in 1987, I won, uh, in, I think it was a string of about, uh, three sport weeks. I won, uh, Iraq race. I won the IMSA race and I won the IndyCar race. uh you know in one month basically and um uh and then of course the lumberman's race in 1979 with uh brian redmond who invited me to drive with him and uh i raced in europe at the time in formula two and came over and and that was a big price money race i think we won like almost 40 000 which was more than you know more than just about anything that was great in mid ohio at the time so You know, again, the two IROC races, uh, those victories were there. Um, so, you know, uh, two or three IMSA races, uh, you know, two, uh, IndyCar races, um, you know, a one-off race with the Lumbermans and, and, uh, and the, um, and the, um, the Camaro races, you know, with, uh, the Roger Penske was producing. Um, so it was good, uh, you know, a lot of success and just very thankful for our, for all the benefits, all the, all of the luck we had.

BRUCE:

I would imagine that 1986 victory at Mid-Ohio had to be pretty special and pretty emotional because you had won the Indianapolis 500 earlier that season, and that happened about 10 days before Jim Truman passed away from cancer. So here you return to Mid-Ohio, a track that Jim Truman had owned, a track that was near and dear to your heart, a lot of it because of Jim Truman, and you ended up winning the race there. I'm not so sure a lot of IndyCar people from that time realize today just how emotional and how important that victory was to you. How do you describe what that race was like to win that race after Jim Truman had passed away?

ROGER:

Well, I mean, you know, for sure, uh, uh, you know, um, all of us are true sports, you know, Steve Horne, everybody involved with the team, uh, going to, especially after Jim's passing. Yeah. Going to really every race, but obviously middle Ohio, uh, being different as he owned the track. And now his widow, Barbara Truman, owned it. And I know I have known Barbara since 1973, I think it is. And, you know, so we went to that track, you know, with a lot of I don't think any of us felt pressure necessarily. But, you know, I felt I think we all felt like, you know, You know we should win the race and because it one tron to i think by that time and after indy and. Show and we are great i call him grant newberry was my engineer and he was he was really doing a great job a super job and so. you know, I think we went there feeling, uh, you know, pretty confident and those, you know, in those days you could test the circuits. So, you know, we would test there as we would test at every other circuit that we could get to. And, um, uh, and, and so, you know, we had good test sessions there. And I said, I think we all felt, um, that, uh, there was every reason to believe that we could be, um, competitive and, uh, You know, Danny Sullivan and I had a, had a good race going and, um, you know, probably, I guess it was right after the last touchdown, if we were able to, to get ahead and, uh, um, and, you know, and when the race and, and, um, you know, that was, that was, that was big for us. And also that would have, and then our third, I think it was our third victory that year, which would, which would lead us on to win the championship. So the 86 Stephen was. Yeah, really kind of, uh, you're talking about on year, you know, losing, uh, Jim, you know, leader, uh, the guy who gave us all the opportunities and, uh, and then going on winning all these races, including him at Ohio and winning the championship. So, and of course, winning Indy for him, which was a, uh, you know, a dream of his. So, uh, 86 was a heck of a year.

BRUCE:

Now, if you could help connect the dots here, because I believe you're a man who has more home states than a lot of Maldy Indy 500 winners have victories. Are you from Ohio or are you from Illinois?

ROGER:

I was born in Ohio. I was not in Ohio for too long after being born. My father was transferred to Chicago area. and we lived and lived in Pennsylvania for a year and then you're in Pennsylvania in like 1960 back to Chicago. So I was probably, you know, you'd say, well, I was born in, in, in Ohio. So therefore I'm a Buckeye. Uh, I was raised in Chicago, outside Chicago, but I went to university in, uh, in Ohio, uh, at Denison. And so that was from 1971 to 75. And then of course I moved back. Jim, in 1981, probably more years in Ohio than I did in Illinois, or it's pretty close one way or the other. So, if I look at how many years I've spent in Ohio and you add it all up, uh... between college between my first year uh... and uh... on earth and then uh... and then living and i lived in uh... columbus ohio from nineteen eighty one to two thousands thereabouts so uh... when you know a lot by probably spent more time in ohio so i'd like to think of myself as a black eye and of course i was a as a hostage and long before graham was so i think that that counts for something to

BRUCE:

So if you consider yourself an Ohioan who was born in Medina, spent a lot of time in the Columbus area, then how do you explain to people from Ohio that in the 2016 World Series you rooted for the Chicago Cubs over the Cleveland Indians as they were known at that time?

ROGER:

Now wait a minute, and you know this. My grandfather, when I would go visit my grandparents in Medina, When I was a younger boy, my grandfather would take me to a Cleveland Indians game or a couple. And of course, every night, whenever it was on TV, they'd be watching Indians games. And there I am. And this started from, I don't know, probably when I was 7, 8, 9, 10. you know, now those are the days of Rocky Calavito and Tito Francona and you know, all that, that whole crowd. And so I was, I have to say, I, I, and I showed this to people that if Cleveland had won, I would have been, I would have been, I would have been, I would have been good with that. Cause I, you know, Cleveland, like, like the Chicago Cubs haven't, haven't, haven't the most successful years over, over the course of time. So I, I had a little guy, and lose either way, but obviously, um, yeah, being a Cubs fan also, and having long prior, uh, you know, to their, uh, to their first, uh, victory that, you know, well, I, I know I'm just, I, you know, as I've told many people, I was, and I was good if Cleveland won the world series or if the Cubs won now, naturally, you know, it was longer for the Cubs, but, um, But, you know, Cleveland has struggled over the years at having the Cubs. So it was good to see the Indians in the Wolf Series, and then it was good to see the Cubs.

BRUCE:

All right. Well, I'm going to take that question one step further. You're an Ohio State football fan, but your wife is a Notre Dame football fan. So how does that all work out?

ROGER:

Well, But can I tell you in the national championship game, I was at the club, our country club with a bunch of friends, and she was at home watching the game with a bunch of friends. So in other words, it would not have been, it would not have been a good thing for us to be in the same, in the same vicinity to one another watching that game. And so, and she still has yet to congratulate me for Ohio State winning the national championship. So I don't know, you know, what does that tell you?

BRUCE:

Well, for the sake of harmony, you probably made the right call. But speaking of the right calls, in addition to your two IndyCar wins at MET Ohio, You finished on the podium, eight of your 16 career starts on that circuit, including the last two races in 1997 and 1998. So it wasn't like you won or else you were always competitive at mid Ohio. What was it about that track that you really liked that really suited Bobby Rahal?

ROGER:

Well, you know, I, I just liked the flow to it, you know, and it changed, right. And 80, 85, six, I think maybe seven, I'm not quite sure when they got rid of the keyhole, uh, you know, they, they went straight up to the top of that corner, uh, turn two, you would call it now, but there used to be two corners prior to that, uh, what they called the keyhole. And, um, So I went on both those kinds of tracks, and I really like just the ebb and flow of the track. I love the up and down to it. In the back, it was very challenging. I always felt that Mid-Ohio was a faster track than it looked. that you really would work at getting the car, especially the tighter corners that you could really carry more speed through those corners than maybe you thought initially. And yet, and I think also the thing that I respect of mid-Ohio, and I think every driver out there would tell you is that physically it's super demanded. There's no time to rest. Elkhart Lake, great circuit, but you have long straightaways that you can kind of you know certainly catch your breath or you know you have you got time to do some things in mid-ohio you're busy all the time and uh... and i don't think anybody would uh... would doubt that it's maybe the most physically demanding circuit on uh... on uh... on the car uh... uh... site and a schedule of races so That might have something to do with it. It's just, again, such a super challenging track, and I just really enjoyed it from day one, from my first time on it.

BRUCE:

We'll be right back to Pit Pass Indy after this short break.

WILL:

This is Will Power of Team Penske, and you're listening to Pit Pass Indy presented by Penske Truck Rental.

BRUCE:

Welcome back to Pit Pass Indy. Here is the rest of my exclusive interview with three-time IndyCar champion and 1986 Indianapolis 500 winner Bobby Rahal as we head to mid-Ohio for the July 6th Honda Indy 200 at mid-Ohio. When you arrived in IndyCar, you were different because you were college-educated, and at that time, a lot of the IndyCar heroes were not. So how different was that, uh, that your arrival kind of ushered in a new era of IndyCar racing?

ROGER:

Well, of course, you know, I mean, the guy who really beat us all to that was, you know, Mark Gunhew. And he certainly used his education to, um, to create great race cars for, for he and for Roger Penske. Um, Uh, you know, uh, yeah, I mean, you were, you were looked at, but maybe a little bit of suspicion, you know, that a college kid, you know, I didn't drive dirt. Right. Um, I wasn't a dirt track guy, uh, at the time when I came in and in 82, there were still a lot of guys that, um, you know, more dirt track guys, you know, Mike Mosley, of course you had Steve Chassie, of course Al Unser Sr., Al Sr. was a hell of a driver on road courses, as well as, you know, same thing with Mario, you know, and, you know, others. And, you know, Rutherford, you know, he was a, He had had some success on road courses, but he was more successful on oval tracks and dirt tracks. So I mean, not having run on dirt, when you went to India, people would kind of look at you like there was something a little bit wrong with you. But, you know, I think over time that if you say that changed, you know, Danny Sullivan, you know, there were others that came in and had gone to college or some college, whatever. So it was just kind of a change in the guard, you know, to a certain extent. And, you know, that that happens in the race. And there was also a change in the guard in that there were a lot of guys, you know, I call them the class of 65. You know, it was Mario, John Cook. you know, Al, Al senior, you know, people like that, that had been there for many, many years. And, and so, um, it, by, you know, by 85, some of them were towards the end of their careers and, and more young guys were coming in. Some of them had gone to college and, you know, it was, you know, that was just the way it was.

BRUCE:

Did some of the old guard question the college guys toughness?

ROGER:

Oh, I don't know. Um, A guy who I really got to like a lot was Gordie Johncock. And he was about the last guy that I thought would say anything good to me. But after Indy, the race for Hammond and Indy, me and Al Senior were in the middle of, he had mirrors for a while. And I remember George Huening, his mechanic, telling me that after the race, Gordy said, hey, who was in that car? And, and, and, um, George told him and he goes, you know, I, I, that was pretty good. And, you know, um, and, uh, and so, yeah, it was the guy I didn't think I'd have, uh, would be accepting or whatever was very accepting. So, I don't know. I think people, um, you know, you can go to college and still be tough, right? There's a lot of hockey players that go to college and they're tough, tough guys, right? So I don't, I don't think it's, yeah, I, I don't ever recall anybody, you know, you know, anybody doubting, you know, when my, my capabilities just because I have Olympic dollars, I don't recall any of that.

BRUCE:

What was your relationship like with Mario Andretti?

ROGER:

uh... you know mario uh... you know to me mario was a yardstick you know uh... he was the guy that if i could compete against mario on any given day at that rate at the end of that race i'd really felt like i'd done something and of course it's it's odd when you're you know it's kind of a weird situation when you're first coming up and you know you've been admiring this guy i mean i saw the mario race at sebring in nineteen sixty nine Yeah, personally, because my father was in that race. And so it's weird when you race against your heroes, you race against these guys that you've had tremendous respect for, and all of a sudden you're kind of I don't want to say you're equal to them, but you're competing equally against them. And that's kind of a weird deal. And I think if you talk to a lot of young guys coming up, they would tell you all the same thing, that when you're racing against your heroes and now you're out beating them or you're out competing against them equally, it's like a strange situation. I have tremendous respect for Mario because he really made his own way. He came from nothing, hard work, determination, brains. Mario is a super smart guy. Uh, yeah, I, I have a tremendous amount of, uh, of respect for that. And so, um, yeah, I, I, I consider Mario, uh, I mean, we were always very competitive, you know, the, you know, Ray hall versus Andretti, whether it was Mario or Michael was kind of an ongoing thing for, for a number of years. And, um, but that, you know, that's racing, right. That happens. And so I, uh, um, you know, I have a lot, I have a lot of time for Mario.

BRUCE:

But another driver from your era, in a lot of ways, I would say he was your contemporary. He may have started a few years before you did. Your career lasted a few years after his ended. Rick Mears. And there was a guy who, he wasn't college educated, but he was very smart. He ran dirt, although it was dune buggies and off-road vehicles, not so much dirt cars like in USAC, sprints and midgets. But what was the relationship like with Rick Mears? Because here you are, Bobby Ray Hall, rather well-educated individual. Rick, a very smart guy, very nice guy, it would appear like with the fans. But what was your relationship like with Rick Mears?

ROGER:

I think, Rick, I've always felt we had a good relationship. I mean, you know, his family, you know, Roger, good guy. Yeah, I, you know, We play golf together, uh, uh, on occasion, on more than one occasion, a golf course in particular, but elsewhere. And, uh, I have a link with a lot. I think, I mean, he's a driver and, um, so yeah, I mean, I think we've always had a pretty good relationship and, um, you know, it's, it's that, um, That accident at Thaner really hurt him. Actually, that hurt him more so on the road courses than on the ovals. I mean, on the ovals, he was still winning races, and he was broke. He was nowhere. Injuries he suffered at Thaner really were debilitating in a lot of ways.

BRUCE:

Uh, how about Danny Sullivan? Danny was a guy who during his era was kind of a glamor boy of IndyCar. He won some big races. He won the Indianapolis 500 in 1985. What was it like, uh, you know, when Dan, what, what did Danny Sullivan bring to IndyCar racing that really seemed to attract some new fans, a younger audience back in those days?

ROGER:

Well, I don't know. I mean, I, I, you know, I knew Danny, I mean, I raised against Danny from 1974, maybe, um, certainly, uh, you know, certainly seven, six, seven, seven, uh, in formula ethics, um, we raised in New Zealand against each other in the player series and Canada. Uh, and in those days, uh, I I've known Danny for a long time and, um, Yeah. Uh, again, Danny, good guy, you know, um, you know, I think our, uh, you know, again, we, when you were competitive to one another, there were races that he beat me and in the race that I beat him. But I think it was always, um, I mean, Danny's a gentleman. He's a good guy. And, uh, you know, his family would hang out with my family, my parents, his mom and dad, great people. Uh, and, um, uh, you know, it, it, yeah, I didn't, uh, there was, you know, every time we see each other, I think there's, it's a, you know, it's a good thing. We all, you know, um, are happy to see each other fight, you know, and Danny was, you know, Dan, I think what Danny brought to, um, to IndyCar, um, let's face it, you know, he was, he was, you know, on TV and he was, you know, he was with, uh, you know, with Roger, he, you know, I mean, you know, he was very promotional, conscious, you know, I mean, he, he, he was a marketing, I mean, he understood what he had to do to, to create his long-term success. And so it wasn't, it was just, it wasn't just driving a race car. And yet, you know, when he, you know, there were, you know, when he was on, when it was his day, he was, he was cuffed to beat. I mean, being 85, I thought, I remember that at Laguna Seca. I can't remember what year, like 90 or somewhere around there. And he just, he was in a different race from everybody else. So, I mean, yeah, Danny, Danny, a good guy.

BRUCE:

And also, I'd be remiss if I didn't bring up two of the greats, not only of their era, but really of all time, Al Unser Jr. and Michael Andretti. They really seem to have their own little special rivalry going on, and you were able to be part of that when they were at the top of their game. When you look back at those two drivers, when they were at the very top of their racing ability, how would you say how good they really were, especially in the history of the sport? Oh, well.

ROGER:

Well, I'm a huge adult junior fan. Um, you know, we were teammates in 90 and 91. Um, I, as I've told, as I said to people, um, it's, it's kind of a, the most unlikely friendship because you know, uh, Al's 10 years younger than I am. He's from Albuquerque. I'm from, you know, Ohio, Chicago, Ohio. Uh, I went to college, he didn't, he ran dirt. I didn't. And yet, um, and yet when, when we first met him and when we first, you know, race against each other for sure. And then to be at or afterwards, um, I don't know. Uh, it's just a weird deal. I, I, in every day, he was a good race car driver. Uh, it didn't matter what I never. Again, I have a lot of respect. I have a lot of, as I said, yeah, you know, Al, right from almost the get go, we, we really, there was something that connected us, you know, something that, I don't know, we find each other or we, because we got along and I mean, we were tough competitors, but we got along and, You know, I have to say, he's probably one of the few guys where I felt bad. And I think he felt bad too. And so I have tremendous respect for Al. He was a hell of a race car driver. I'll tell you that, right? I mean, he was damn, and in everything that he touched, you know, whether it was, again, IROC. I mean, you know, he won the IROC series, what, twice? And they didn't like it when IndyCar guys would go down there and show them up. You know, if you remember, Al was running the top three or at Daytona 500 and, you know, with, I don't know how many laps to go, you know, he got, you know, somebody, somebody gave him a little, you know, a little love tap and there he was, he was off into the wall, but he could have won that race probably. And so I, I have a lot of respect for Al and he's a good friend. Always enjoy seeing him. And again, he was a hell of a teammate and a hell of a race car driver.

BRUCE:

The driver that gave him the love tap drove a car number three. And what he did was he kind of elbowed him in across the trial grass there at the speedway. But I remember that move vividly.

ROGER:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Al was right there and. Yeah, you know, and again, as I said, Al won IROC series twice, I believe it was. And, you know, that, you had to, you had to depend on the old, the old courses. And, um, and he did that. And, um, you know, so, uh, I, I really, I rate, I rate Al as, you know, one of the best drivers out there.

BRUCE:

And then of course, Michael Andretti was part of that era.

ROGER:

Uh-huh. Yeah. And Michael and I, you know, we had, um, I mean, you know, uh in in my tree championships you know michael finished second in each of those and uh you know michael was a hell of a driver too um you know i've never had much of a relationship with michael but he was a great driver and you got to respect that and um you know he uh uh Yeah, driven if my son was on the same team as I, because even Alan for senior one times to ask me how I could do it. And I, I said to him like, well, what do you mean? Well, how can you watch your son race? I go, well, hell, how could you, how could you race against your son? You know? And, uh, uh, so, uh, yeah, I, yeah. But Michael was a great driver and he won a lot of races and a lot of pole positions and, And, um, so you, you gotta, you gotta respect that and you gotta admire that.

BRUCE:

Now, circling back to Ohio and your son, Graham Rahal had to be one of the highlights of your team owner career. Obviously winning the Indianapolis 500 is a highlight of your team owner career. Not once, but several times. But how big of a day was it at mid Ohio in 2015 when Graham Rahal won that race? It's important to you, but it was also hugely important to him.

ROGER:

Oh, no, it was, it was, it was, yeah, it was great. And, and the fact that, you know, um, after the restart, he held Justin, his friend, Justin Wilson, you know, he and, and Justin were pretty tight and, you know, held them off and then drove away. And, um, I think he won by over three seconds in the last time, maybe it was seven laps or something like that. So, I mean, just, you know, and, um, Yeah, I mean, uh, for him, cause it's middle Iowa was really his home track in, in many respects. And so for him to, to win that day, um, um, I, I know is huge for him. It was huge for all of us. And, um, and of course, uh, you know, how can you, how can you not think it was preordained when you're wearing a house, a Buckeye, uh, uh, paint scheme on your helmet. Yeah. So, uh, I, I, I almost, I hope he's going to go back with that helmet, but I don't know.

BRUCE:

We've seen many great drivers, we've seen many great streaks, but right now we're seeing another one with Alex Polo with Chimp Ganassi Racing. How do you even begin to describe just the incredible streak that he's on and the incredible talent that he's got?

ROGER:

Well, it's like, you know, Any driver will tell you it's all about the team. And I mean, Alex is a hell of a driver. There's no doubt of that. He's proven that and he's a smart driver. And, you know, he really has tremendous talent, but, you know, he's got a great engineer, you know, as his engineer. I mean, really one of the best ever. Uh, he's got a great team behind him. Uh, and, and, you know, I mean, he's, he's got, he's got the team of engineering, the team of mechanics, everything is just world-class there. And he's, he's benefiting from that. And he'd be, I think he'd be the first one to tell you that, but he's also taken advantage of what he's got. And, uh, and so you got to save that, you know, both entities can actually racing and, uh, and, uh, and Alex are, you know, it's a match made in heaven, right? And he's, yeah, he's making it look so easy, and yet it's not easy. It's just that they're doing a better job than everybody else at this point.

BRUCE:

Also, a driver who makes running the Indianapolis 500 look easy drove for you this year, Takuma Sato. All you got to do is plop him into the car and he goes fast. How amazed are you that for an Indy 500 one-off like him, that he just picks it right up where he was when he won the race for you back in 2020?

ROGER:

Well, that's Takuma, right? I mean, if there was ever a track meant for a guy, for a driver, you know, and he, uh, I mean, he just, he has, you know, when he drove for us in, what was it, 2012, I mean, he was turning right as much as he was turning left. I mean, he can drive such a free car, and that's so critical at Indianapolis. And, you know, I really think it's such a shame that he had the problem coming into the pips, what was it, the second stop or whatever, I don't think anybody could have stopped him. He had the car, he had the engineering, the mechanics, everything. He could easily have won his third race and just that one mistake kept it from happening. I don't think Takuma will see. You know, I think he, you know, he's, he's like 44, I think 43, but he's a very young 43. He's a 25 year old, 20, 43 year old. So I think he still has a lot of drive and still have a lot of talent and is smart. You know, uh, at Indy, I think he's very smart. And, um, I think, you know, I wouldn't be surprised to see him come back.

BRUCE:

I'm not so sure Takuma Sato is that young. I think he might be a little bit older depending on, uh, he's 48. He's, he's a little bit older than that.

ROGER:

Is he 48? Wow. January 28th, 1977. Oh, that makes it even more amazing.

BRUCE:

Right? So. Speaking of amazing, you've got a couple of young drivers on your team that go along with Graham Rahal. One of them won his first career poll at Road America, which as you well know, that's not easy to do. But Louis Foster seems to be having a pretty good rookie season. How do you gauge his development?

ROGER:

I think Louie is, frankly, I've been very pleased. I mean, right from the get-go, he showed his competitiveness. He's qualified well. We had some issues not really on with him getting the feet done correctly, because there's that, like, at thermal, he was having some muscle and back issues as a result of the seats. We got that figured out. I mean, my God, you know, again, poll position at. at Road America, and that, you know, it was, you just gotta be impressed by that, and there's been other, you know, Detroit qualified, what, seventh, I think it was, and was running third behind Graham, and, you know, then Graham had the problem in the pit stops, you know, the wheel coming, wouldn't come off, or came off, and then wouldn't come off. I mean, Louie's done a super job, and, you know, I really think he's, A star of the, he might already be a star of the series, but a star of the future for sure. And so I think he's got a long runway ahead of him for many years. And, you know, even he did well at, you know, at, he had, you know, a couple of speeding tickets at Indy and Devlin were running up front ahead of, ahead of Palou for many laps. And, and so they still, he can still, I think he can get it down in the ovals as well. So I think Louie's got a big future ahead of him.

BRUCE:

And also Devlin seems to be driving better this year. What do you see as the reason for that?

ROGER:

Well, I think it's, You know, for, for a lot of drivers, it's all about the environment within the game. And, um, yeah, I think the environment that we're, we're giving him is, um, is one that he can, you know, um, thrive in, you know, do well in. And, you know, uh, there, there've been a number of races where he'd been super competitive and, and gone fast. So I, uh, you know, Indy, I thought he had a good month of may. And, um, so I think, um, you know, there's, he can run up there and it's just, whether it's road course or a little track and a drift, uh, um, you know, he's going to have some good, strong races. I mean, we have virtually half the year left, so he's going to have some good, strong races.

BRUCE:

And before I let you go, I want to ask you a couple of quick topics real quick. IndyCar announced the new car is going to come out in 2028 or that's now the new target. A lot of people are new cars are going to cost team owners a lot of money. Chip Ganassi has asked why exactly do we need a new car? If you ask some fans that they want a new car badly because they're pretty much getting tired of seeing this car. The engineers want a new car to work on because they've pretty much done everything that can be done to the current car. You as a team owner, what's your reaction to seeing it delayed? I had one driver tell me the frustrating thing is everything seems to never happen on the time frame that it's supposed to, whether it be the hybrid assist being delayed last year and now the new car being delayed a season into 2028. You as a team owner, you're the one that's got to write the checks for the new car. What's your philosophy and attitude on the new car?

ROGER:

Well, I mean, I'm, you know, yes. Do I, well, I like to see a new, more sophisticated car. Yeah. Um, do I understand, uh, you know, the costs involved with that? Yes. You know, so on one side, um, as a sports person, as a, as a fan of racing, yeah, I'd love to see more, you know, uh, maybe a different looking car. Although I think the current one is still a pretty good looking car, but, but, you know, I, um, environment, um, you know, if not, uh... you know what when they took when that when that when when the u.s. government banned the beer companies in the tobacco companies uh... from uh... supporting motorsports sports in general that took a tremendous amount of money out of out of sports and uh... and you know uh... in those days union had cool marlboro uh... to cody Miller, Budweiser, you name it. The money was there to change cars every year or what have you, but the money is no longer there for that. I mean, you know, you know, there's nowhere, you know, you used to have, you know, Ford was, was supporting teams with engines, Toyota, Honda, you know, not just engines, but money. And those days, that's not the way it is today. And so you have to be responsible to the financial demands that are necessary because you want strong teams. And these teams today are better than they've ever been in terms of the quality of the people and what have you. So, yeah, it'd be great to have new cars. But I have no problem with holding off for a while. I will also say, the GTP category, we run BMW's program in North America, that was supposed to end at the end of this year as far as the existing chassis. That's just now been extended. till 2030, I think it is. And everybody's doing it because teams around the world are facing the same pressures. And although I'd tell you in Formula One, there's a handful that have no problem meeting the budgets that Formula One calls for. And there's a lot of others that are hanging on by their fingernails. So I think it's the right thing to do. I would certainly like to see our sponsor or our teams, I would certainly like to see Honda and Chevrolet do more promotion of their involvement in IndyCar racing like they used to. And for that matter, X-Trac and Cosworth, or not Cosworth, but X-Trac and others, so the vendors, promote the fact that you're in that you're in the series. But, you know, given that that's not the case, and I think it's, you know, we have to be careful on the money side. That's just the reality. And in the meantime, we still have great racing. And I don't, I think that's the most important thing is, do you have great racing?

BRUCE:

But one partner who does promote is the TV partner, Fox Sports. They got over 7 million people to watch this year's Indianapolis 500, the most in 17 years. Their overall ratings are far ahead of what last year's average was. It almost becomes news now when a race dips below the million mark, whereas before we would have taken those ratings and cheered happy days are here again. But what do you think of the effort that Fox Sports has done, not only promoting IndyCar, but getting viewers to tune in?

ROGER:

Yeah, well, as I've said before, I thank God for Fox because you know, air shanks and the group, the commitment that they're making to IndyCar is, um, is, is, it's tremendous, phenomenal. And don't just, don't just think about TV. I will tell you every race we've been to this year, every race has had, if they aren't record crowds are close, right? Indy, it was full. Elkhart Lake's packed. I mean, um, I'm, I'm sure mid Ohio will be packed. Um, I mean, St. Pete, great race. So, I mean, it's not just for TV. There's no question in my mind that are becoming more and more interested in following IndyCar. And I certainly give credit you know to fox for sure but also to the series and to the level of competition exists and uh... and uh... efforts that the teams make on behalf of the series in the drivers make on behalf of the series and you know it goes on and on and so i i i really you know but there's no doubt there's no question that that fox that that relationship is huge for brandy car and you know I know they're committed to really building a franchise with IndyCar like they did with NASCAR. I mean, they were important to the growth of NASCAR, you know, 10, 15 years. And so, you know, I think it's an awesome thing and, you know, just very pleased.

BRUCE:

And finally, the road leads back to mid-Ohio. A lot of people used to say Fourth of July weekend isn't a really good weekend to get people to come out to go to an auto race. But yet the date seems to work pretty well from at Ohio. It's almost like IndyCar's 4th of July vacation. It's almost like IndyCar's weekend at Boy Scout camp. Call it whatever you want, but it really has created this great little niche on the schedule. And how important is that?

ROGER:

Well, I, you know, I've been, you know, every year I go to Middle High, there's more people, you know, and especially over the 4th of July weekend. So it doesn't look like a negative to me to have a race in Middle Island that weekend. And, you know, we We go around every year, Saturday night, Grandma and I go around on a golf cart, just say, and give a few hats out or whatever. And the passion to the sport that's exhibited by the fans at Middle High is huge. And so I don't think that's an issue. And of course, Middle High, they have their own fireworks show, as does everybody else. you know, camping out and everything else. So, I mean, I don't see that as a negative at all. And I think it's maybe even a positive to Middle Highland for being, you know, being on site there. Yeah.

BRUCE:

They've embraced having a race on the 4th of July weekend, made it work. I can recall sometimes we went to Watkins Glen and some other places. where it didn't work. Kudos to the people that run Mid-Ohio now, Kevin Sabry and Kim Green and his staff to be able to take that. Mid-Ohio is not in the most populated part of the state, that's for sure. But on race day weekend, it becomes its own small city, which in a lot of ways is pretty cool to see that many people as you're driving through the cornfields of Amish country and all of a sudden you happen upon Mid-Ohio and there's all these campers there. It's one of the great Fourth of July celebrations.

ROGER:

Yeah, I'm telling you, I cannot wait to go. Uh, just like Elkhart Lake in a road America saying, I mean, I, you just cannot wait to go there. Cause you know, it's going to be a hell of an event on and off track. And you see people who loves IndyCar racing. And I'm really excited, excited about that.

BRUCE:

Well, Bobby, we're all excited about going to that. You've been a true legend inside the car, but an even bigger legend as a person outside of the car with a lot of your things that you do both in business and charitable contributions and just being a good friend to me in the program. Congratulations on being honored this weekend at the Honda Indy 200 at Mid-Ohio. Good luck the rest of the season. I know you're building a pretty formidable team down there in Zionsville, Indiana. You certainly have a race shop that can put other race team shops to shame.

ROGER:

Yeah. But you know, and I will also tell you, bring in J fi into the organization has been huge for us. He's done, he's doing not done, but he's doing a great job. And, uh, uh, you know, uh, Jay's a racer and I love it. And he's a competitor or what, you know, I love, you know, whether it was, whether it's him starting off four years at, uh, in Missouri, you know, in football or whatever. I mean, the guy's a competitor. I love that. So, uh, Yeah, there's some good things happening at RLL.

BRUCE:

Well, it's great that a lot of good things are happening there. As I've said, you've been a great ambassador for the sport, not only as a driver, but as a team owner, but just generally all around supporter of IndyCar and of racing in general. Good luck this weekend with giving the command, drivers start your engines.

ROGER:

Yeah, yeah. That's a lot of pressure, you know.

BRUCE:

Well, it is because all of a sudden when they turn that on, if you trip up on it on Word, you can't go back and edit it out like some of the things I get to do here on this interview. If I mess up a little bit, I can go in and trim it out. But anyway, good luck this weekend and thank you for joining us today on Pit Pass Indy presented by Penske Truck Rental.

ROGER:

My pleasure. We'll see you this weekend.

BRUCE:

We'll be right back to Pit Pass Indy after this short break.

SCOTT:

Hi, I'm Scott McLaughlin, driver of the number three Team Penske Chevy, and you're listening to Pit Pass Indy, presented by Penske Truck Rental.

BRUCE:

And that puts a checkered flag on this edition of Pit Pass Indy, presented by Penske Truck Rental. We want to thank our guests, three-time IndyCar Series champion, 1986 Indianapolis 500 winning driver, and two-time Indianapolis 500 winning team owner, Bobby Rayall, for joining us on today's podcast. Along with loyal listeners like you, our guests helped make Pit Pass Indy, presented by Penske Truck Rental, your path to victory lane in IndyCar. On the highways, the raceways, and every pit stop in between, Penske Truck Rental keeps you moving forward. Gain ground with Penske. For more IndyCar coverage, follow me at X, previously known as Twitter, at BruceMartin, one word, uppercase B, uppercase M, underscore 500. This has been a production of Evergreen Podcast. A special thanks to our production team, executive producers are Bridget Coyne and Gerardo Orlando. Recordings and edits were done by me, Bruce Martin, and final mixing was done by Dave Douglas. Learn more at evergreenpodcast.com. Until next time, be sure to keep it out of the wall.