A Front-Row Seat with the Sportswriters Who Sat There
Sit down with host Todd Jones and other sportswriters who knew the greatest athletes and coaches, and experienced first-hand some of the biggest sports moments in the past 50 years. They’ll share stories behind the stories -- some they’ve only told to each other.
Al Pearce: “Richard Petty looks at me from behind those sunglasses and . . . “
Sit down, strap in and go for a thrill ride with Al Pearce as he recounts more than five decades of writing about motorsports, particularly NASCAR. Al talks about his early days around stock car racing and how he’s covered 54 consecutive Daytona 500s. He puts us alongside iconic drivers such as Richard Petty and Dale Earnhardt Sr., and he recalls the courage and persistence of Wendell Scott, the first African-American driver to race full-time in NASCAR. Al also takes us to Montreal for Formula One racing, and he discusses how all drivers deal with the danger of their profession.
Pearce has covered thousands of races of all types: NASCAR, IndyCar, Formula One, NHRA and IHRA drag racing, APBA powerboats, SCCA, international sports cars and weekly short-track races. Motorsports has taken him to 50 states and a half-dozen countries on assignment including Japan, Australia, Mexico, Canada, and Le Mans, France. Al covered motorsports for the Times-Herald and Daily Press in Newport News, Virginia from 1969 until his retirement in 2004. He is still a NASCAR contributing editor for Autoweek magazine, which he has written for since 1973. Besides racing, Al also wrote about professional, college and high school sports throughout his 35 years in newspapers.
The Media Wing of the International Motorsports Hall of Fame at Talladega, Ala. Inducted Pearce in 2003. That same year, he received the Henry McLemore Award, the highest recognition for a motorsport journalist. He’s also been honored by Langley Speedway, Pocono Raceway, Martinsville Speedway, and by the Peninsula Sports Club. Al won eight Virginia Press Association Awards, and he’s a member of the Virginia Sports Hall of Fame.
Pearce has written 16 books about motorsports. “NASCAR 75 Years” is his latest. It was co-authored with Mike Hembree and published in April 2023. Al is a native of Rocky Mount, Virginia, graduated from Presbyterian College, and served in the Vietnam war as an officer before beginning his journalism career in 1969.
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Al Pearce edited transcript
PBA_Al Pearce
Speakers: Todd Jones & Al Pearce
Todd Jones (00:03):
Okay. We're going to talk some motorsports today. And if you want to talk motorsports, you go to Al Pearce because Al has covered auto racing for more than 50 years. 50. Think about that. He was there back in the 60s when NASCAR was just a little stock car circuit. Wasn't even on television nationally.
Todd Jones (00:30):
we're going to cover a lot of ground, not just NASCAR, but Al's covered auto racing throughout the world. We're going to hit him up for some stories. Al, I'm so glad you're joining us on Press Box Access. Welcome.
Al Pearce (00:43):
Thank you. I'm honored that you would invite me on. I've seen your list of previous guests. It's pretty formidable and I'm honored to be among that group, so I'm ready. Let's go.
Todd Jones (01:02):
Hey, first of all, I wanted to say congratulations. In February, you covered your 54th straight Daytona 500, 54. And I know you had some health issues prior to that in December, a mild heart attack. It's easy for me to say mild, right?
Al Pearce (01:23):
Yeah. It's mild when it happened to somebody else.
Todd Jones (01:28):
Oh, yeah. It was mild.
Al Pearce (01:30):
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was my 54th consecutive. Long, long ago, I mean, even 10 years ago the Speedway people told me that my streak at that point was by far the longest of anybody, and I've continued to add on to it. So, I'd like to go again next year.
Todd Jones (01:56):
54 in a row. That's just amazing to me. I mean, hell Al the track should have started charging you rent back in 1970.
Al Pearce (02:14):
Actually yeah. I missed the 69 race. Because I became a reporter after that first year of Daytona. I actually began my sports writing career in the middle of ‘69. And Daytona had already run.
Al Pearce (02:33):
So, the 70 race was my first one. Let me tell you what, I thought I knew everything. I mean, I just felt like I knew everything it was to know. Early in that race, Richard Petty blew up, came to the pit area and got out and went down to where his teammate, Pete Hamilton, his team boys. And I said to somebody next to me, like I knew what I was doing, "Well, you watch it there, Richard's going to pull that young kid out and get in the other kid's car and finish the race in the other guy's car."
Al Pearce (03:09):
Well, as it turns out, he didn't, it turns out his teammate, Pete Hamilton, won that first race. So, I very quickly realized I didn't know nearly as much as I thought I did.
Todd Jones (03:21):
Well, that goes for all of us in sports writing, right?
Al Pearce (03:24):
Yeah, yeah.
Todd Jones (03:24):
We're all just kind of faking it.
Al Pearce (03:27):
Yeah. It kind of goes back and this is a story that people will tell you about me.
Todd Jones (03:35):
Oh-oh. Here we go.
Al Pearce (03:36):
So, I'll tell it myself. The first race I ever covered as a reporter was the first ever race at Dover, Delaware in the summer of '69. Dover had just opened; it was the first race. I drove up there from Newport News and I covered it. And I'm at the back of the press box because I'm the new kid. I'm brand new, and I'm at the back of the press box, and Richard Petty won the race.
Al Pearce (04:06):
So, Richard comes to the press box, answers a bunch of questions, and I just feel like I've got to establish myself. I've got to tell people who I am. So, from the back of the press box, I very tentatively raised my hand. Yeah boy, I said, "Mr. Petty," which is my first mistake, "Mr. Petty, why did you climb out the window and not just open the door in Victory Lane?"
Al Pearce (04:41):
And he looked at me from behind those sunglasses and said, "Boy, you don't know much, do you?" And I said, "No sir, but I expect to learn." And from that moment on, Richard and I had been, I think, pretty good friends, so-
Todd Jones (04:58):
That's amazing.
Al Pearce (05:00):
That's the first race I'd ever seen. I didn't know. I had no clue. And this left leg comes out of the car window and the right leg, and Petty comes out and waves at everybody. And I'm thinking, just open the door. What's the big deal? He said, "Boy, you don't know much, do you?" And I said, "No sir, but I expect to learn."
Todd Jones (05:26):
That's a great story to start with. I love it.
Al Pearce (05:29):
And I think I have.
Todd Jones (05:30):
I think you have too. 35 years at daily newspapers, at Times Herald and Daily Press and Newport News, Virginia, 50 years on Autoweek, you're still a contributing editor. Racing's taken y'all over the world, 50 states, Mexico, Canada, Australia, Japan, Le Mans, you've won every kind of award. You're in all kinds of Hall of Fames.
Todd Jones (05:56):
But when you showed up a month before that race, when you showed up at the Times Herald in Newport News, the sports editor had one question for you, right?
Al Pearce (06:06):
Well, it was back up just a couple of weeks. Graduated from college in '65, taught high school for a year. The army got me for three years, including the two in Vietnam. I got out of the Army in June of '69 with no prospects. I didn't have any idea what I was going to do.
Al Pearce (06:34):
A friend of mine told me that the local newspaper was looking for a new guy because one of their reporters had just left to go somewhere else. So, I drove down there unannounced, uninvited, walked in, asked to speak to the sports editor, and I was lucky enough to get an interview that lasted about five minutes.
Al Pearce (06:59):
He wanted to know all about me. College graduate, yeah. Military, yeah. And he said, "Well, you obviously know about football, like mainstream sports; football, basketball, baseball, you know all that stuff.” Well, yeah. Most people my age did.
Al Pearce (07:18):
Then he looked at me and he said, “What do you know about stock car racing?” And I immediately realized if he had a question that specific, that was something he needed. And I lied through my teeth, I lied like a politician. I said, "Oh, man." I said, "I'm from North Carolina. I know Richard Petty." He is from North Carolina.
Al Pearce (07:46):
I said, "I've been to Daytona (which I had as a fan), I've been to Daytona. I know Richard, I know everything you need to know." And then he said to me, "When can you start work?" And I made a big deal of looking at my watch. And I said, "Well, right now."
Al Pearce (08:06):
So, in June of '69, I started, and in November of '04, I retired from that job.
Al Pearce (08:15):
Now, early in 1970, early, Autoweek called me, they needed the NASCAR race at Richmond covered. And they knew I was only 60 miles away. So, I covered for Autoweek in Richmond that year. And they liked what I did. And they ... I'm still there.
Todd Jones (08:37):
Yeah, still faking it, right?
Al Pearce (08:38):
Yeah. I'm still at Autoweek. So really, I mean, I tell people unashamedly, I lied my way into a job. But I felt like after giving my country a year in Vietnam, I could lie just a little bit and become a sportswriter.
Todd Jones (08:57):
Oh, hell yeah. I mean, thank you for your service, and if you can fight your way through Vietnam, you can come home and lie your way into a sports writing job of all things.
Al Pearce (09:07):
Yeah, yeah.
Todd Jones (10:24):
You know how to write about auto racing. I mean, in 2003 you won the Henry McLemore Award. That's the highest recognition for a motorsports journalist.
Todd Jones (11:13):
And one of the things I wanted to ask you about is you've covered thousands of races of all types, and we're going to talk a lot of NASCAR, but you've done IndyCar, Formula 1 NHRA, you've done Powerboats, Go-carts.
Al Pearce (11:25):
Yeah.
Todd Jones (11:25):
Short tracks. When you think about all the racing that you've covered besides NASCAR, is there something that, a story that sticks with you even today that is very memorable? Maybe it's a certain place you were at, or an event or a driver that's not related to NASCAR?
Al Pearce (11:49):
Years and years ago, Autoweek had a deal where they wanted to send their NASCAR guy to a Formula 1 race and their Formula 1 guy to a NASCAR race, the same weekend. And I was fortunate enough to go to Canada for the Canadian Grand Prix. Now, this is maybe 30 years ago, and I was absolutely blown away by the level of technology and the level of engineering that goes into a Formula 1 car.
Al Pearce (12:30):
I couldn't imagine, because I had never seen one up close until I went on the grid that weekend and realized how many computers are in the garage area, how many electronic devices are used to make a Formula 1 car go fast.
Al Pearce (12:50):
I watched part of yesterday's Miami Grand Prix and again, this is 30 years ago in Montreal, but I'm sure that things exponentially have gotten way, way, way more complex. And I'm thinking, how do these people figure this out?
Todd Jones (13:07):
Right.
Al Pearce (13:11):
And having been around stock cars for so long before Montreal, all of those cars are fairly simple. Back then, eight cylinders, carburetor, the regular, what you think about is a car, nothing computerized. Back then, NASCAR didn't even allow you to hook a computer to a car, except in a private test you could do it there.
Al Pearce (13:43):
So, NASCAR was basically primitive compared to Formula 1. And I did not realize how advanced Formula 1 was until I went to Montreal and left there thinking, my God, those people, they're either brilliant.
Al Pearce (14:01):
And the other thing that impressed me about Montreal was the money that seemed to be there, the social scene, the yachts along the waterfront. I was told about all the jets that had flown in that weekend, all of which was just something I couldn't quite fathom until I looked at it and saw it up close.
Al Pearce (14:21):
So, Formula 1 just blew me away because I was not prepared to see things that sophisticated.
Todd Jones (14:33):
Yeah. I think sometimes if folks could just walk into a garage, they probably have it in their mind what it's like, but if you took them into pit row, it's like a different world.
Al Pearce (14:46):
Yeah, yeah.
Al Pearce (15:29):
And compared to NASCAR, IndyCar's 10 years ahead of its time, but compared to IndyCar, Formula 1 is 10 years ahead of its time.
Todd Jones (16:43):
Al, when you think about all the different types of racing that you did cover throughout your career and still do, what is the common denominator in your mind and how do you approach telling a story to an audience because of that?
Al Pearce (17:02):
The drivers, whether it's a powerboat, whether it's Miss Budweiser or Miss Atlas Van Lines or whatever, whether it's a powerboat, a Formula 1 car, an Indycar, a weekly short track, dirt track cars, the drivers are all as committed and dedicated to what they're doing as anybody can be in any other sport.
Al Pearce (17:34):
Now you hear about so and so went out a driving range, he hit a thousand golf balls. So and so went out on the tennis court and served a thousand times, to prove how much they loved their sport.
Al Pearce (17:51):
These guys, from the time that Daytona opens in February until the time Homestead or Phoenix closes in November, the NASCAR guys of whom I'm most familiar, they are basically 24/7. They've got something to do almost every day. Now, it may not be at a racetrack because there's not much testing any longer, but it might be a PR deal, it might be a sponsor deal, it might be a photo shoot somewhere.
Al Pearce (18:28):
Drivers across the board dedicate as much time in their life to racing as any athlete in the world. Todd, I think the general public underestimates how good these people are at what they do. They are the best of the best. You talk about Tom Brady, which is fine, or Patrick Mahomes, which is fine, or anybody else. They're great. Aaron Judge is great. Tiger Woods used to be great. Those guys are as good at what they do as anybody.
Al Pearce (19:10):
These guys are too. And I think that the public generally looks upon it as well, they're just sitting in a car, they're driving in a circle for four hours. How tough can it be? Well, let me tell you, it's pretty tough.
Todd Jones (19:26):
Well, they're putting their life on the line.
Al Pearce (19:28):
Well, yeah, they do that. That's the other thing. Unfortunately, I have seen a number of people killed at a racetrack in front of me. You don't expect to see a golfer die. You don't expect to see a tennis player die. We almost had an NFL guy die this past year. He apparently has recovered well. But I have seen people killed at a racetrack, Daytona, Talladega, Martinsville, little half mile track. I've seen people killed there.
Todd Jones (20:02):
But I think that's where the commitment to the focus that's necessary, when you climb into that car, whatever type of automobile it is, whatever type of racing machine it is, you need that type of commitment and concentration and focus to do your job.
Al Pearce (20:20):
But I think if you ask them, if you ask Kyle Larson or Denny Hamlin, or anybody who raced yesterday, when you got in that race car today at 3:15, did you have any idea that you might not come home tonight? And they'll say, no, never crossed my mind. Never crossed my mind.
Al Pearce (20:46):
The weekend after Dale Earnhardt got killed at Daytona, the next weekend Junior, his kid, wrecked on the first or second lap at Rockingham the next weekend. And all of a sudden people are saying, "Oh, my God, big Dale just got killed. I sure hope Junior's okay."
Al Pearce (21:06):
Later on, Junior told us that never crossed his mind that he would die like his father did. So yeah, there's a commitment to that. But I don't think they dwell on it. They just don't … you know.
Todd Jones (21:27):
Yeah. I know from talking to racers, they just don't go there. They can't let themselves go there.
Al Pearce (21:30):
Right, exactly. And the other thing is (they will not admit this), but a lot of them would race for a lot less money than they're going to make.
Todd Jones (21:40):
Don't tell anybody that.
Al Pearce (21:41):
Right. The trophy, they want the trophy. That's all they care about. Give me the trophy.
Al Pearce (21:50):
Many, many, many, many years ago, Wendell Scott the only African — well, until Bubba came along, Wendell Scott was the only African American driver of any note in NASCAR. And he won a race in Jacksonville, Florida one night. He’s 63.
Al Pearce (22:08):
Well, the people in Jacksonville that night at that racetrack were not about to have a black man get up on stage with a white beauty queen and take the trophy, post her pictures. That's the way it was in Jacksonville, in the early 60s.
Al Pearce (22:33):
So, they came up with this bogus scoring error in which Buck Baker, a white champion, popular driver, Buck Baker, was given the opportunity to go up on stage, kiss the beauty queen, go through all the post-race hoopla and he had not won the race.
Al Pearce (22:56):
And Wendell Scott knew he had not won the race. Wendell knew that he had won it, and he quietly said to the officials, “I'd like a scoring recheck.” Well, it took about two and a half hours to recheck scoring when everybody knew that Wendell had won the race.
Al Pearce (23:17):
The promoters in Jacksonville wanted to clear the grandstand. They wanted everybody gone before they said a black man has won our race. And all through his life, the rest of his life, Wendell and his family, the only thing they wanted from Jacksonville was the trophy.
Al Pearce (23:40):
They had given the trophy to Buck Baker, who had taken it back to Charlotte. Wendell got his money, but the family spent the rest of his life, and up until about two years ago, trying to get the trophy.
Todd Jones (23:56):
Did he get the trophy?
Al Pearce (23:58):
He got facsimiles and replicas because the Baker family said, "Gee, we don't know where it is."
Todd Jones (24:04):
Wow.
Al Pearce (24:05):
"Buck won so many races, he gave trophies away. They're out in the garage, we don't know where they are." So, Wendell never got the original trophy he deserved. But it says a great deal about the sport that Wendell was more concerned about not getting the trophy he had earned than the money.
Todd Jones (24:28):
Right.
Todd Jones (24:39):
Did you ever talk to Wendell at length about that whole experience?
Al Pearce (24:42):
Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah.
Todd Jones (24:43):
How did he deal with it?
Al Pearce (24:47):
He was the most resilient, the most ... resilient is the best word. He hardly let anything bother him. He came out of Danville, Virginia. The story is true that the local short track promoter in Danville was looking for a black driver to kind of bring some more crowd to his racetrack.
Al Pearce (25:21):
And the local promoter went to the Danville Police and said, "We're looking for — they didn't use the word African American or black at the time, “But we're looking for this type driver to maybe attract a few more fans.” And the police said, "Well, there's this guy named Wendell Scott who hauls moonshine, and we can't catch him."
Al Pearce (25:49):
Literally, this is the story, "We've been chasing Wendell for years. We know who he is. We know where he lives. We don't know where he picks up his loads. We don't know where he drops them off, because every time we catch him, he's clean. He's done, he's finished for the night. Get him."
Al Pearce (26:07):
So, the local promoter went to Wendell Scott and said, "I'll tell you what we'll do. If you come out and race at our racetrack, we'll guarantee you X amount of money," because he knew that Wendell would attract African American fans. "We'll take care of you. We won't let anybody bother you."
Al Pearce (26:27):
And Wendell became so successful on the short tracks in Virginia and the Carolinas. They eventually went to Cup and eventually won a race. He's in the NASCAR Hall of Fame. He never ever let the intimidation, he never let the threats, he never let the post-race deep down into dark woods on the two-lane road, roadblocks bother him.
Al Pearce (27:09):
And his sons, and I think one of his brothers, sort of like the Wood Brothers, the family was the team. The sons were the crew and all. And Wendell just said, "This is our career. This is what we're going to do."
Al Pearce (27:26):
And he was an excellent mechanic. He worked on his own car. And later in his life, when it became clear that he was a serious racer, he was not just a publicity stunt, people began to give him used parts and pieces. The Pettys were good to him. Bobby Allison was good to him. Holman Moody team was good to him.
Al Pearce (27:53):
But he was basically unsponsored his whole career and won a race fair and square and earned … you talk about a guy coming up from nothing to having some success in racing. Wendell Scott probably came from as little as anybody's ever had to become a winner. A one-time winner, but a winner just the same.
Todd Jones (28:21):
I'm so glad you've shared this about Wendell. I mean, he's a name that doesn't get enough attention, gets lost in history. And you think about the courage he had in the car and the courage out of the car.
Al Pearce (28:33):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He never, from what I can tell, and again, I talked to him, I talked to his family as recently as a year ago, I don't know that he ever stooped to retaliate to what was done to him.
Al Pearce (28:51):
Now on the racetrack, if you roughed him up, he'd rough you up if he could. That's a fair game. Everybody does that. Ross Chastain does that. Everybody does that.
Al Pearce (29:04):
But I don't think Wendell ever retaliated outside the race car. He never walked down to another guy's pit with a tire wrench and started whipping on him. I don't think he ever did that. He was a gentleman.
Al Pearce (29:22):
Again, I started in '69 and he was racing then. And I count myself fortunate to have seen people like Buck Baker and Wendell Scott and LeeRoy Yarbrough, a lot of guys who had short-lived careers. Not necessarily short-lived, but Wendell's career ended with an injury in Talladega. I'm so glad I got to see him race. And got to meet him and write about him.
Todd Jones (29:52):
That's fantastic that you shared this with us. I really appreciate that, Al. It's great that you brought up Wendell and gave us some much-needed detail about his-
Al Pearce (30:02):
The point being, for most of these guys, the trophy is a bigger deal. They've got all the money they need. Kyle Busch and Kurt Busch and Joey Logano and Kevin Harvey and Dale Earnhardt Jr, they've got all the money they'll ever need. They're racing now for trophies, but they won't tell you that.
Todd Jones (30:23):
That's true. And nobody won more trophies than Richard Petty. And you mentioned that the Petty family, going back to his father Lee, the Petty family was good to Wendell Scott, which says so much about the Petty family.
Todd Jones (30:38):
And you can't say enough about Richard Petty the driver. He is the guy who set the standard that everything's measured against. 200 wins in his amazing career, 1958 through 1992, 35-year career.
Todd Jones (30:52):
When a guy reaches a status like Petty, it’s iconic. Look at his nickname, "The King." I know from a few times that I was fortunate enough to talk with Richard, I always felt like I was talking with my neighbor.
Al Pearce (31:13):
Yeah. Oh, yeah. And the reason being, he came from a lower crossroads community in North Carolina that there might have been a hundred people that live within five miles of him, a little place called Level Cross. And Richard and his father Lee and his brother Maurice did not know anything growing up except being hardworking, humble, nothing big about me. I'm just a race car driver, kind of guy. And Richard never lost that.
Al Pearce (31:56):
You see Richard at the Waldorf for the banquet, he'd still be wearing his cowboy hat. He'd still be wearing his sunglasses. He just never changed. He was and remains the most humble, the most down-to-earth real person I think I've ever met.
Al Pearce (32:23):
Whether he's in the company of me and a bunch of reporters behind the hauler, or whether he's at the White House getting the Presidential Medal of Freedom, which he did. Whether he's at the United Nations or whatever, no matter where Richard Petty is, he's the same guy who grew up in Level Cross going to a … I don't know, maybe a two or three-room school and just racing, because that's what his father did. And that's what he did after his father.
Todd Jones (32:58):
Give us a story about witnessing something about his humbleness.
Al Pearce (33:07):
Todd, I have seen him sit on the edge of a pit wall at Martinsville in particular, after a 500 lap race, which he probably won, or maybe didn't, didn't matter. He's sitting on a concrete brick wall at Martinsville and signed autographs until it got too dark to see. Now Martinsville has lights now, they could go to midnight. Who knows.
Al Pearce (33:33):
Back in the day, Martinsville did not have lights. And it got fairly early in September when they ran their fall race, Richard would sit there on a wall, cross his legs, keep his hat on, and he would sign every autograph, everything that was brought to him.
Al Pearce (33:56):
It might be a book about another driver. Somebody might have brought him a book about Cale Yarborough, and Richard would still sign it. Richard would sign. And I've done stories about Richard and his signing, and he has signed some of the most unusual things.
Todd Jones (34:18):
Okay. Give us some
Al Pearce (34:20):
Well, I mean-
Todd Jones (34:20):
What does he sign? Come on now.
Al Pearce (34:23):
Ladies have been known to present body parts, which he politely held up. And his signature goes forever.
Todd Jones (34:39):
Well, there's a lot of body parts, Al, come on.
Al Pearce (34:42):
Right. Well, they present one of two body parts and he'd sign it. I've seen him sign animals.
Todd Jones (34:51):
Oh, come on, come on. Really?
Al Pearce (34:53):
I've seen him sign, a lady or a gentleman will come up to him with a little puppy, short-haired dog. And the man with the dog would give Richard a bigger than usual sharpie. Not the little skinny kind, but a big sharpie with a big blade. And Richard would sign the side of the dog. And never complain, never say, oh, man …
Todd Jones (35:27):
Did the dog have any say in the matter?
Al Pearce (35:29):
I don't think he did. No, neither … well, but the lady did earlier. He is just the best. For 25 years I did Kyle Petty, his son, Lee's grandson, did a cross country charity motorcycle ride for 25 years. We rode from basically the West Coast to the East Coast, occasionally up and down.
Al Pearce (35:55):
But in any case, Richard did most of those races or rides. And we would stop in a little town somewhere in the middle of Kansas. And there would be some people there, had lunch waiting for us, hot dogs and sodas and beans and whatever.
Al Pearce (36:16):
And there would be no place to sit. Everybody would just grab the seat wherever they could. And Richard would plop down under a tree and lean back and eat his hot dog and drink his soda. He wouldn't ask anybody to go get it for him. He'd stand in line like everybody else. He'd sit wherever he could under a tree, on a park bench, whatever.
Al Pearce (36:43):
He never asked for anything more than the rest of the us were getting. We had to stand in line for our hotdogs, Richard stood in line with us. I don't think he's ever felt like he's anybody other than just a regular person who has a particular job that a lot of people enjoyed watching him do. And he said a million times, if people don't want my autograph, I'm nobody.
Todd Jones (37:18):
Right, right. Well, he did his job better than anybody. 200 victories. One of the things I love about Petty's career is that it should have been 201 victories.
Al Pearce (37:27):
Should have been, his father took one away from him.
Todd Jones (37:29):
His first one, right?
Al Pearce (37:30):
Yeah, yeah.
Todd Jones (37:30):
Richard wins his first race and his dad protest-
Al Pearce (37:34):
Protested the score. And there's a reason for that. It was at Lakewood, Georgia, near Atlanta. I don't remember the year. Early 60s, maybe one or two. Anyway, Richard was driving. Back then, they'd run regular hardtop cars and convertibles.
Todd Jones (37:58):
Convertibles. Think about that.
Al Pearce (38:01):
Yeah. Well, the beauty of that was if you're a fan and you're watching convertible race, you can see the driver. You can look down and see what they're doing.
Todd Jones (38:11):
Wow.
Al Pearce (38:12):
It was very popular for a long time until convertibles ceased to become a popular showroom item. So, Detroit quit building them mostly.
Al Pearce (38:25):
Anyway, Richard was in a hardtop, and Lee was in a convertible. And it was called a sweepstakes race. And the purse was written such set, if the winner was in a hardtop, he'd earn, I don't know, $2,000, whatever the number was. If the winner was in a convertible, he'd win $2,500. A little bit more.
Al Pearce (38:58):
So, Richard wins. Lee finishes second. Lee immediately protests the scoring and however it happened, the scoring eventually came around to where Lee had won. And Richard later on would say to me and other people, not just me, others, “Well, what was your daddy thinking?”
Al Pearce (39:23):
And Richard would look at us and he'd say, "Remember, this was in the early 60s. We were just getting started. For my daddy to win $500 more than I would've won was a big deal." He said, "I learned very quickly not to question anything my daddy did from a business perspective." He said, "I still think I won that race, but daddy got … Petty Enterprises got $500 more for him being the winner than if I'd been the winner. So, everything worked out fine."
Todd Jones (40:00):
What a smooth move by Lee. That is tremendous.
Al Pearce (40:03):
Yeah, yeah.
Todd Jones (40:05):
And good for Richard for recognizing the need.
Al Pearce (40:08):
Yeah. And at the time Richard was maybe 18 or 19. He wanted to race so much and so desperately; he wasn't going to make a fuss. And have his father say, "Well, I'll tell you what, young boy, you go find a ride wherever you want to, you're done with me." Richard knew enough not to rattle his daddy.
Todd Jones (40:29):
That's true. That's true.
Al Pearce (40:30):
And again, back in those days, it might have been the late 50s even. I don't remember exactly. I wasn't there. $500 was a big deal right back then.
Todd Jones (40:43):
Right. Oh, yeah. Hell, I'll take 500 now, Al.
Al Pearce (40:45):
Yeah.
Todd Jones (40:56):
Alright. Richard won 200 wins. That's in the book. It's not 201, it's 200. I wanted to ask you about one in particular. 1979 Daytona 500, Richard wins. It's the first full race broadcast on, it was on CBS.
Al Pearce (41:14):
Yep.
Todd Jones (41:15):
And on the last lap, we hear the announcers say, "There's a fight." You're there.
Al Pearce (41:23):
Yeah.
Todd Jones (41:23):
What the hell happened?
Al Pearce (41:28):
In my humble opinion, it is a race that made NASCAR what it became. That kick started what came after that. Yeah. I mean, Richard was running third at the white flag, well behind, no factor to win at that moment. Donnie, Allison, and Cale Yarborough came off the second turn, pretty much one right behind the other.
Al Pearce (42:00):
And Cale pulled down to the inside to try to pass Donnie. Donnie moved down to push Cale into the dirt, which is a timeless mud because it had rained early that morning. And Daytona back then is not like it is now. If you got off the racetrack, then you were either in the mud or in Lake Lloyd, one or the other.
Al Pearce (42:23):
So anyway, Donnie pushes Cale to the inside. Cale pushes Donnie back to the other way. They go down the back stretch, basically like this hitting each other. Finally, Cale turned right, and he and Donnie both go under the wall, and they slide back down to the banking, to the apron and what is the entrance to turn three.
Al Pearce (42:50):
Well, all of a sudden everybody's saying, "Well, who's third?" Oh, look off of turn two, here comes Richard.
Todd Jones (42:56):
Here comes that 43 Plymouth.
Al Pearce (42:58):
Yeah, the 43 with Richard, and then Darrell and AJ in an equal three car battle. And as the camera flashes by the wreck scene, there comes Richard and Darrell and AJ, and they go on to win that race.
Al Pearce (43:17):
And moments later, there's this memorable yell from Ken Squier, "There's a fight. There's a fight in turn three."Donnie and Cale had gotten out and understandably so. There was a difference of opinion, of who did what to whom? So, they started going at it.
Al Pearce (43:46):
I think if my memory serves, Cale left his helmet on. Donnie foolishly took his off and they got to flooding on each other. Well, Bobby comes around.
Todd Jones (43:59):
Donnie's brother Bobby, right.
Al Pearce (44:00):
Yeah. Bobby comes around, he gets out and he goes to his brother's defense. And Cale basically says, well, just two against one, I'll take both of you. So, they fight for maybe a minute, maybe less than a minute.
Todd Jones (44:16):
It's a pretty good bar fight, but not … there's been better. But seeing these guys wailing away at each other.
Al Pearce (44:24):
Considering who they are, that's the thing. If that had been David Sisco and somebody that we never heard of, and they had been racing for 23rd, would CBS have cared? Well maybe, but maybe not.
Al Pearce (44:38):
So anyway, they fight for about a minute, and helmets are flying, and people are punching each other. And the rescue squad and the officials come and clear it all up. And that was the day, you alluded to it, that was the day that much of America, east of the Mississippi was snowed in by a terrible, terrible storm.
Todd Jones (45:04):
That's right. Yeah.
Al Pearce (45:06):
Planes weren't flying, trains weren't moving, buses weren't going anywhere. People had nothing to do.
Todd Jones (45:12):
Yeah. You had three channels. You only had three channels.
Al Pearce (45:14):
Right. Back then, NBA games had been called off, hockey might have been on, but who knows. Anyway, the point being most of America watched that race for the first time. They'd never seen it. And to see a race that important on a national, over the air network end like that and then there's a fight which excited the fans more than maybe the finish.
Todd Jones (45:43):
Hell yeah.
Al Pearce (45:44):
The next day at work, or the next two days at work, Ken Squier called it the water cooler factor that everybody in every office in America would gather to the water cooler for their morning water drink at 9:30 saying, “Did you see that race yesterday?”
Al Pearce (46:04):
And that basically, I think, got everything started. I think the '79 500 was the biggest deal they've ever had.
Todd Jones (48:34):
It's so appropriate that this happened at Daytona. So much history of NASCAR is wrapped up down there. I mean, dating back to when they were racing on the beach itself. And when you think of Daytona, I know a lot of people they think of Dale Earnhardt.
Al Pearce (48:53):
Yeah.
Todd Jones (48:53):
And you mentioned his death, and I want to ask you about that day, but I also just want to talk to you a little bit about Dale, the person you got to know, the racer. When you think about Earnhardt, what do you think about?
Al Pearce (49:08):
He would not want you to know how soft he was as a human being. He would want you to know he was a badass racer who came from 18th to win at Talladega, who flipped and rolled at Daytona, got out of his car, noticed that the four tires were still up, got back in it, had them push it to the garage where it could be repaired.
Al Pearce (49:40):
He would not want you to know that if you were a member of the media or you were a crewman for another team and something happened back at home and you had to go back to Charlotte or wherever you lived, you could have his airplane.
Al Pearce (50:00):
He would not tell anybody that I sent two guys home yesterday. Their wives went into labor, they couldn't get there and drive in time, I gave them my plane. He'd never tell you that. He would tell you, “I wouldn't wreck my mother to win, but I'd wreck your mother.” And he was that way. He was so focused on winning.
Todd Jones (50:29):
“The Intimidator.”
Al Pearce (50:31):
“The Intimidator.” He would not want you to know that there was a side of him that was altogether different from that.
Todd Jones (50:39):
Did you ever have a personal experience with that side of Dale Earnhardt?
Al Pearce (50:47):
I think at some point all of us interviewed him individually, but it was probably all a racing question. What do you think of the new tires? Well, crap ...
Al Pearce (51:02):
I never talked to him on a personal level, it was always professional. Richard and I had a personal relationship. And Dale was like this with most every media person. He would keep you over there, but he would be polite and accommodating as long as it didn't interfere with being in the race car. I think the thing about that day at Daytona that most of us still remember was it did not look that bad.
Todd Jones (51:37):
Yeah. The day you're mentioning is February 18th, 2001.
Al Pearce (51:42):
We had seen Dale, we had seen a myriad of drivers crash way, way, way looking worse than his. The year that Richard Petty went down the front stretch, rolling and tumbling, got out and waved at the crowd. And I called back and told my wife while he was still tumbling, I think I might have said, "If he's dead, I'm done. I'm not going to cover this crap anymore."
Al Pearce (52:11):
But he was fine. So, when Dale hit the wall and came back down and Schrader got into him, I don't think any of us in the media center or the press box thought anything of it other than, “Boy, he's going to be pissed, he's really be mad,” because he was running third and now he's going to finish 20th or something.
Todd Jones (52:34):
Yeah. It's turn four. It's the final lap of the Daytona 500.
Al Pearce (52:36):
Yeah. Coming for the flag. Coming for the flag.
Todd Jones (52:38):
And it didn't look bad, but he was going 160 and all of a sudden he goes from 160 to 0 and 80 milliseconds.
Al Pearce (52:46):
Yeah. His head went forward and that was before Hans devices. Many tragedies surround that. And I'm not getting teary about that. My eye just waters a lot.
Al Pearce (53:00):
But anyway, there were many tragedies about that, or many ironies about that thing. One of which was Brett Bodine had tested the Hans device several times. Brett Bodine had raced many times the previous year with the Hans device.
Al Pearce (53:21):
And after a particularly bad wreck with it, which did not affect him at all, he never got in a race car again without it. The morning of the race, Brett Bodine went up to Earnhardt and showed him his Hans device. He said, "You really should try one of these things. That wreck I had at Mission last fall didn't affect me at all. You should really try it."
Al Pearce (53:56):
And Earnhardt responded as a badass driver would, by saying — he used the term I'm not going to use to indicate that Bodine was a little less manly than the rest of us, because he's wearing this safety device that hooks to your helmet, your shoulder and keeps your head from …
Al Pearce (54:19):
And Bodine later on said, “If he'd been wearing a Hans device, from everything we have seen of that wreck, he would've survived. No problem at all. Maybe a problem a little bit, but not dead.”
Al Pearce (54:35):
So anyway, that's one thing. Earnhardt was given the opportunity to use the Hans and turned it down.
Al Pearce (54:44):
The other thing people want to say is that Earnhardt was killed blocking for his two team drivers up front. And that's not exactly right. At that point on the racetrack coming through turn four, headed for the little short shoot, those two, Michael Waltrip and Junior were gone. They were going to finish one/two. There was no question about that.
Al Pearce (55:10):
People say, “Well, Earnhardt was trying to block Sterling Marlin to keep Sterling from beating his drivers.” That's not true. There's no way in the world Sterling Marlin could have come from fourth, passed Big Dale, Junior and Michael Waltrip in that distance.
Al Pearce (55:28):
So, Earnhardt was racing for third. He wasn't racing to help his teammates. Now he had been racing to help his teammates on the back stretch earlier. But once they got through turn three and four, and once Michael and Junior settled down coming to the flag, Earnhardt was racing for third and he knew it. So, people would say he got killed protecting his son. That's bull. That's just not right.
Todd Jones (55:58):
That's like mythologizing it. Yeah. It helps people deal with the grief that they felt as a fan.
Al Pearce (56:03):
Right. He was racing for third.
Todd Jones (56:05):
So, when he hits the wall, like you said, you didn't think much of it.
Al Pearce (56:09):
No, no.
Todd Jones (56:10):
What was it like in the press box as it unfolded from there?
Al Pearce (56:15):
The thing I remember most is the car hit the wall. Ken Schrader hit him, and they came down to banking into the infield. Earnhardt obviously did not lower his window net, which is the international sign that I'm okay. If you're in a bad wreck in NASCAR, even if your car won't move or is torn all the pieces, if you let down your window net, the safety crew knows that at least you can do that.
Al Pearce (56:50):
So, for a long time there was no window net coming down. And then when Ken Schrader got to Earnhardt's window and lowered it down, Schrader just kind of instinctively turned away and began to frantically, not just, "Hey guys," frantically wave for the rescue people to get over there.
Al Pearce (57:17):
And the other thing that got our attention was Darrell Waltrip was on TV, on Fox, I think that was the first Fox broadcast. Darrell Waltrip was on there looking downturn toward four. The camera was on Darrell, and Darrell was saying, "Boy, I hope Dale's alright. That's a bad crash people, that's a hard hit. I'm worried about my buddy. I really hope he's okay." That got our attention.
Al Pearce (57:51):
And then when they put him in the ambulance and took him directly to the hospital without bothering to go to the medical center, we figured this is really bad. And they covered the car, brought it to the inspection impound area, and it was a long time before we heard anything from the hospital. And we saw pictures of Junior rushing in with Teresa and I think his sister was with him. I think we all began to realize right then, this could be really, really bad.
Al Pearce (58:29):
We don't know how bad, it could be fatal, it could be life-changing, it could be whatever. And it wasn't until Mike Helton came in the media center and sat up on that chair and said, "I've got terrible announcement to make." And we obviously by then, we knew.
Al Pearce (58:50):
The only question that remains and it's not a big deal, was whether he was dead at the racetrack or died on the way to the hospital. And the important thing there is — not really important now, but if he was killed at the racetrack, it would be handled by the state of Florida as a workplace fatality.
Todd Jones (59:18):
That's interesting. I never thought of that.
Al Pearce (59:20):
If he died at the hospital, it was just another person being brought in and who died. Not that it makes a better difference, but we may never know that answer.
Al Pearce (59:38):
I drove home that night to Virginia, 715 miles overnight, listened to every talk show I could listen to. And most of them, believe it or not, talked about him. You’d think people in Seattle and Chicago and Dallas would say, "Well, they killed another driver at Daytona today. And that's the way it goes." But these people were compassionate and understanding and they realized it was a big deal.
Todd Jones (01:00:08):
He transcended NASCAR, right?
Al Pearce (01:00:10):
Well, yeah.
Todd Jones (01:00:12):
Why is that? I mean, he won 76 times. He won seven championships like Petty and later Jimmie Johnson. But what was it about Earnhardt that made other people who maybe weren't racing fans pay attention?
Al Pearce (01:00:27):
He was every man. He had come up; his father had been a racer who had died working on his race car. Dale came up the hard way driving junk cars until he got decent. He never liked Richard Petty, he never put on pretensions. He never acted like he was bigger than he was.
Al Pearce (01:00:55):
He had a soft spot that occasionally came through that you might not have wanted to see, but he did it. He was basically an outdoorsman. He'd get on a tractor and till a field, he'd get on a Caterpillar and dig a road if he wanted to.
Al Pearce (01:01:16):
He was every man. He was a regular guy. I don't know that he ever went to the White House. I don't know that he was ever honored by any president, or any organizations like to eat you in.
Al Pearce (01:01:33):
But he just had a personality that people enjoyed being around because he played with you. He'd mess around with you.
Al Pearce (01:01:47):
And Junior, his son, is very much the same way. Junior is an absolutely wonderful human being. Compassionate, caring, will do anything for you if he can, does that little podcast of his and talks to people and ask hard questions. But doesn’t go beyond whatever line has been drawn.
Al Pearce (01:02:11):
That whole family's … their mama raised them right as said, their mama and their daddy raised them boys right, so-
Todd Jones (01:02:20):
Right. Well, Earnhardt's death, obviously was kind of like a line in a sand. It was a moment in time that you can look at NASCAR before then and NASCAR after then.
Al Pearce (01:02:33):
Well, it's amazing how many people say, "Well, race is not like it was when Earnhardt was alive." Well, the racing itself is even better. The actual on track competition is better.
Todd Jones (01:02:48):
Why do you say that?
Al Pearce (01:02:50):
Well, there are more cars, there are more teams. I mean, Rick Hendrick has got four cars capable of winning. Joe Gibbs has got four cars capable of winning. Richard Childerss has a car and a half capable of winning. Trackhouse obviously has a car and a half capable of winning.
Al Pearce (01:03:13):
Back in the day when I started, it was Petty, period. It was the Petty Enterprises, Holman Moody, Bud Moore and somebody else. There were only about five cars that could win, back when I started, the Wood Brothers. There were only five or six cars capable of winning when I began covering.
Al Pearce (01:03:37):
Last year, there were 19 different winners, and I think from maybe 11 different teams. The depth of competition is so much greater now because the money and the sponsorship, the technology is so much greater.
Al Pearce (01:04:39):
Now there's a age old question. People ask me all the time, what's more important, the driver or the car? And I say, well, put Kyle Larson in a car that usually finishes 25th and Kyle Larson can finish 9th or 10th. Put a 25th place car driver in a car that normally wins, and he'll finish 12th or 13th. You've got to have the right driver and the right team to win.
Todd Jones (01:06:16):
That's what makes sports fun though, right? Those type of debates.
Al Pearce (01:06:19):
I would say that the car is marginally more important than the driver. A good car and a decent driver will win, a good car and a bad driver will not. A bad driver and a good car, probably not going to win much, but maybe, so there you go.
Todd Jones (01:11:23):
Well, I'll tell you what, I don't even know how to change the oil in my own car.
Al Pearce (01:11:28):
Well, I don't either.
Todd Jones (01:11:29):
But I know how to talk to somebody who knows racing. And that's you Al. And I really appreciate, you've taken readers along for the ride for many, many years. And I want to thank you for taking our listeners alongside with you too on this episode.
Todd Jones (01:11:42):
It's been really a joy to talk with somebody who's been around so many great moments and drivers and teams in the history of motorsports. I really appreciate this.
Al Pearce (01:11:54):
I'm glad to do it. Glad to be here.
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