Donna, How did you fix your storytelling problem?
If you’ve been in a relationship with someone for a long time– whether that be romantic, platonic, or familial, you’ve likely heard that person’s stories over… and over… and over again. Donna Guthrie, today’s author, is here along with her husband to share how they came up with the perfect tag-team storytelling strategy.
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Speakers: Krista Baum, Donna Guthrie, Mike Guthrie & Emma Yaniga
[Music Playing]
Krista Baum:
Hi, welcome to the Storyworth Podcast, we're glad you're here. I'm your host, Krista Baum, co-founder of Storyworth. On this podcast, we feature true stories written by Storyworth writers. If you're new to Storyworth, we help people write their life stories, the big stories, and the small ones.
Once a week we send our writers a question to help inspire their writing. They reply to the email with an answer or a story that comes to mind. At the end of the year, we print what they've written into a beautiful keepsake book.
Every story written using Storyworth is private, but for this podcast, the writers volunteer to share their stories publicly with you.
If you've been in a relationship with someone for a long time, whether that's romantic, plutonic, familial, you've surely encountered this issue before: hearing their stories over and over and over again.
Today's story is about one couple's strategy to avoid boring their audience with unneeded details and sloppy plot arcs, whether their audience is at a dinner party or friends, or simply just each other, sitting at the kitchen table.
Donna Guthrie, today's author, is here along with her husband, to share how they came up with the perfect tag team storytelling strategy. But before we talk to them, we're going to hear Donna's story as read by voice actress Emma Yaniga, as Donna shares her mission to spin her husband's lackluster storytelling approach into gold.
Emma Yaniga:
45 years into a good marriage, something crept into our relationship that led to public arguments and silent car rides home. It wasn't as dramatic as a secret gambling habit exposed, nor was it easy to articulate like a partner's incessant soup slurping while dining out. Similar to many longtime married couples, we had what I call a storytelling problem.
When Mike and I were dating and getting to know each other, our stories were captivating. I still smile when he shares the story about his first experience getting drunk, stealing the pastor's truck, and crashing it into a row of tombstones.
He made it sound like a joy ride with frog and toad. My new man sounded fun-loving and adventurous, and a bit of a bad boy, I was smitten. Now, fast forward nearly half a century, and you bet we can recite each other's stories word for word, finishing the other sentences and piping in with forgotten details.
We have the same children, the same friends, and 45 years of the same life experiences. And there lies our problem, at this point, we're supporting characters in the same exact stories.
When I'm narrating a recent anecdote about my 80-year-old friend who just entered the world of online dating, I like to set up the story with a little background. I mentioned the man's 60-year marriage, his devotion to his late wife and the fact that she battled dementia.
But my husband can't be bothered with these details and at this point in my storytelling, he always interrupts to rush me to the funny part, which is (in his opinion) the part where my friend reveals a laundry list of qualities he requires for an ideal match.
According to my friend, his love interest can't smoke or drink and shouldn't be overweight. She can't take any medications or use a walker, or have a tattoo. But most importantly, she has to be an engaged passenger. She can't crochet, sleep or read while he's driving.
My husband finds it hysterically funny that our friend would disqualify an 80-year-old prospective date based on an old tattoo or her tendency to doze off in the car: “Get to the punchline,” he coaches me: “Give the background information in one sentence,” as in my 80-year-old friend has started dating again.
I'll confess I interrupt too, but for good reason. Sometimes my hubby just doesn't accurately gauge a person's interest in the story he's so invested in telling. For instance, my husband has a lot to say about the current state of healthcare in this country, but when his opinions last through drinks and then appetizers, I feel for our companions.
It's up to me to interrupt and mercifully change the subject. And if his story still manages to persist, like the little engine that could right into the main course, well, I'm simply left with no other option than an under the table kick to his bad knee.
The use of numbers in our storytelling also causes conflict. See, when I tell a story that involves numbers, I like to round up as a general rule. When he tells a story, it's like he's balancing the checkbook.
If I say our wait in the airport was three hours, he interrupts my story just to point out we actually waited two hours and 10 minutes. Is this a male thing? Does anyone really care about an extra 50 minutes? But we do agree on some ground rules.
Mike and I made a commitment to each other not to be those old people who tell long graphic stories about their health and the details of recent operations. It's best to share our health sagas with fellow survivors, and even those stories should have a time limit.
We also came to the mutual realization that repetition is a problem for us. Over the years, we've listened to one another repeat the exact same story in the exact same manner to the exact same people.
Yikes, I don't mind hearing my husband's stories 10 times because I love him and the first five times, I even love the story, but it's different for our friends. So, for the sake of better storytelling, we devised a series of covert hand motions, much like a catcher or a third base coach might exchange.
The subtle tapping of his right index finger is code that my anecdote is getting too bogged down in the details. Or when I gingerly tug my left ear, he catches the signal that his story has gone on too long and needs to wrap up.
This new focus on how we tell stories has actually made us better listeners. We take mental notes of storytellers who have a strong sense of timing, story arc, and audience attention. There's really an art to it after all.
Recently we're testing out a new strategy, telling our stories together by taking turns. When I detail our family's disastrous bike ride across Wisconsin, I pause at just the right point in the story and ask my husband to jump in. He clarifies the precise number of cyclists involved and the total miles we traveled.
And if it's one of his stories, I'm invited to set up the story and summarize the long parts, and he gets the glory of revealing the punchline.
Now, our car rides home are happier without the tense silence. We've replaced public arguments with private feedback because stories (especially the good ones), require practice.
Last night at a friend's house, my husband told the one about our wedding reception when too many glasses of champagne led to a midnight swim in the hotel pool by my fully clothed tea drinking Methodist family. He nailed it.
[Music Playing]
No ear tugging necessary — his 40-year-old story was fresh and new again with just the right amount of details. And my family's late-night adventure sounded funny and madcap just like Frog and Toad. And once again, I was smitten.
Krista Baum:
After reading this story, I was really excited to chat with Donna, our author, and her husband Mike. Here's a bit of our conversation. As you'll see, they're extremely charming.
Tell me a little bit about how you met in your love story?
Mike Guthrie:
We had friends in common and they were married. They kept calling us, pestering us a bit independently, obviously, “You ought to meet this girl, you ought to meet this guy.” We’d go back and forth, and finally Donna got fed up with him and called me and very independent woman, she always has been.
And said, “Let's get this out of the way, let's have coffee and it should be fun.” So, I said, “Why don't we meet on Saturday?” I think it was a Saturday and we met about 10 o'clock in the morning and we were still there at about seven or eight o'clock at night.
Krista Baum:
No way.
Mike Guthrie:
Still talking to each other, we've been talking to each other ever since.
Krista Baum:
That's awesome.
Mike Guthrie:
Although we were just talking this morning about mumbling things so out loud to each other across the desk. We share an office and so we're mumbling things back and forth to each other and it's getting worse. We should hold …
Donna Guthrie:
So, let me just add one thing. We met at the end of October, he proposed in February, we got married in June.
Krista Baum:
No.
Donna Guthrie:
Parents never met. My parents never met him until we’d wedded.
Krista Baum:
Oh my gosh, you guys are couple's goals. I love this. So, who came up with the baseball signal solution?
Donna?
Donna Guthrie:
I did. I don't know if you just heard how he told me that story, but he's gotten much better at telling that story.
Mike Guthrie:
I have had to learn over time, and it's been a learning experience. I really appreciate some of the insights she said about stuff because it's really helpful. I learn how to accommodate to her professionalism about telling some of these stories.
Donna Guthrie:
Story's a beginning, a middle, and an end. This is 50 years, we're still working on this.
Krista Baum:
I know, but you look like you're still having so much fun.
Mike Guthrie:
We don't take it too seriously. But the important message is that I really have learned a lot from her. And it's not just because she confronts me all the time, but it's been an experience.
Krista Baum:
Did you guys try anything before the baseball signals that didn't work?
Mike Guthrie:
Yelling at each other after the …
Mike Guthrie:
That didn't work.
Donna Guthrie:
That didn't work.
Krista Baum:
Alright.
Donna Guthrie:
You know, you're driving home from party and say, “I wish you wouldn't interrupt me when I'm telling the story,” because people don't care whether it's 4.4 miles or 4.9 miles …
Mike Guthrie:
30 or 40 years.
Donna Guthrie:
Exactly. And you know, we used to get angry over …
Mike Guthrie:
Donna got very angry. I didn't get angry … I was doing. We had to come up with something that was in the moment because after the fact was so depressing, you couldn't do anything about it. She was pissed off and I couldn't do anything about it. So, I wanted to get closer to, well, “Stop me, give me a sign.”
Krista Baum:
I would actually love to hear the Frog and Toad story and the drunk Methodist in the swimming pool if you're up for telling them.
Donna Guthrie:
Well, this is the one where you can't see us …
Mike Guthrie:
The truck and …
Donna Guthrie:
The truck and the great monster.
Mike Guthrie:
Oh God!
Mike Guthrie:
First of all, it's talking about things which were against the law.
Krista Baum:
You certainly don't have to …
Donna Guthrie:
You're 76, I don't think they're going to arrest you right now.
Mike Guthrie:
My first job was in the graveyard. I was a grave digger, as a kid, young boy, because that's about all I could do. At the time that was relevant, we did a lot of gardening and stuff around the cemetery, and we worked for this real character who was a very mole-like guy.
But at one point, he decided there was two of us who were boys who worked for him and he decided at one point he was going to get us beer. So, one afternoon we got intoxicated and we decided we were going to use the cemetery’ truck for a drive. Neither one of us was 16, just so you know.
So, we took it out and the cemetery's a vast area, it stuck into a park. The back end of it was all wild, but there was a forest service road that ran through it. And we got on that forest service road going too fast. Sure enough, we come around this corner, all leaves from the fall on the ground, the tires were bald of course, and so don't sleep off … we go and bang into a tree.
And that was a shock. My father (bless his heart) was really mad at me. So, all the money I had made went to pay the cemetery for a new truck.
Krista Baum:
Oh no.
Donna Guthrie:
We met and married very quickly, we just phoned it in. We just said, “Invite your friends and I don't know, get the place and we'll show up that weekend.” And my parents were strong Methodist and not drinkers, but we knew that we were going to have alcohol at the wedding.
Dad didn't know how much to buy, so they were … let's say they were 85 people coming. So, he bought 85 bottles of champagne. Not good champagne, just champagne. So, a bottle of champagne for everybody.
So, we get married on a Friday night, go to a reception, people are drinking champagne, we're at a hotel in Washington, Pennsylvania, and Mike and I said, goodnight and go to bed. My brothers and sisters continue to drink the champagne all around them.
And then they decide that they're going to go swimming. Of course, the swimming pool is closed, and they climb over, jump in with their clothes on and of course, the police are called.
Mike Guthrie:
The Fire Department
Donna Guthrie:
No, I don't remember the Fire Department — the police were called.
Krista Baum:
So, how did you get started with Storyworth? Did one of your kids give it to you or what's the …
Donna Guthrie:
Our daughter, Carly gave it to both of us the same year. But we had heard about it from a friend who had done it and gotten so much out of it. It's getting the story once a week, it's so doable. If somebody said, “Write your life story,” everyone is overwhelmed by the idea. One question a week is doable, it's just plain fashion doable.
And so, we knew a friend who had done it and gotten so much out of it and made books for all of his kids and it was very, very meaningful.
Krista Baum:
Have you solved any other issues that have popped up in your marriage with creative solutions? I'm asking for advice in case it comes up in the course of my marriage?
Mike Guthrie:
It's pretty broad.
Donna Guthrie:
I'm sure we have.
Krista Baum:
I feel like this could become like a relationship self-help podcast.
Mike Guthrie:
I think for us — I'll speak for myself, but humor has been awfully important for us in terms of mitigating things. I've heard a lot of people say that it's really helpful to take things a little lightly and yourself not too seriously.
[Music Playing]
Donna Guthrie:
I think plain old-fashioned courtesy with a longtime mate, “thank you or please,” I know that sounds silly, but Mike happens to be a great cook. I tell him that. This was great and thank you for doing it.
Mike Guthrie:
Doesn't want me to stop.
Donna Guthrie:
No, I do not want you to stop. I think if couples were just a little bit kinder and a little bit more courteous to one other, instead of just immediately going for the yell, all the negative stuff — please and thank you go a long way in our relationship.
Mike Guthrie:
And I mean people talk about gratitude being an important aspect of life. And I think as we get older, we're a lot more consciously grateful. I think sense of humor is very important in a relationship.
I think it gets you through a lot of tense situations where a lighthearted — and it's based on self-deprecating humor. I think a lot of this stuff is just temporary and its nonsense. The important stuff is the long-term relationship, not short-term wins is very helpful. Not taking yourself too seriously, I think that's really sort of at the core of it.
[Music Playing]
Krista Baum:
Thanks for joining us today. If you want to get started writing your life stories or want to give the gift of Storyworth to a loved one, head over to storyworth.com. And if you'd like one of your Storyworth chapters to be considered for the podcast, go to storyworth.com/podcast.
In our next episode:
Brett Castro:
I guess you could call me a serial troublemaker. If causing trouble is defined by actually getting caught, the nuns could be brutal.
Krista Baum:
One man's experience as an old school prankster trapped in the confines of Catholic school. Storyworth is a production of Evergreen Podcasts, hosted by me, Krista Baum, and produced by Hannah Rae Leach. We get production help from Jill Greenberg and our mix engineer is Sean Rule-Hoffman.
We'll see you next time.
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